Food for thought.........

Yea!

and let's not forget

Tiger has made some excellent points. I might also add the following issues in addition to his excellent ones.

All musicians profit from jazz study . I find it an endless source of inspiration towards the mastery of the art form. We have profited greatly from a period in time when giants walked the earth and left us with a legacy that may take centuries to absorb & study.

- Monk said 'play the music not your instrument.'

Wayne Shorter's lineage to Trane and Miles definitely puts him in the Shorter-Zone imagery category. But there is also a strong influence of Lester Young there. In both his playing and composing, he has set himself apart by the use of contrasting segments in the same composition as well as developing a semi- abstract style of soloing yet one that contains many of the melodic elements of his composing. Listen to his composition ,' Footprints' . Or his excellent recording ,' Adams Apple' .

Ornette Coleman knew and could perform many of Charlie Parker's compositions in a exact bebop style ! Think about that next time you listen to ' Body Meta'.

When Giant Steps came out, we didn't know what hit us. Which was probably similar to the reaction of many musicians first hearing Diz , Monk and Bird.. The way he extended the harmonies on Giant Steps, Countdown, 26-2, Satellite, Fifth House, Body and Soul and others was unprecedented. His lineage was directly out of Parker and Dizzy. As well as the blues and bar walking saxophone styles.

Feeling and sincerity for what you are doing are also important and comes under the category of communication. All of these things come into play each and every day . Dizzy suggests learning the piano, as does Sonny Rollins. Once Jerry Bergonzi told me a story about a student that approached Sonny Rollins....and asked-' Sonny , how can I become a better jazz sax player ?' .....Sonny said- learn piano. This is something which the great majority of jazz musicians do. It not only allows you to see the harmony, but to hear the sounds, which is really what we are talking about. Then you must translate this to your instrument; if it's the piano, you' re half way there.

To me , communication is most important . So, it there is no direct communication with the audience for which you are playing, there goes your job.

John Coltrane used to talk about imagining his music reaching out and embracing his audiences.

Should we strive for any less ? :::::::::::::Bright Moments::::::::::::::::: Tim Price

It might be 'stop whining about equipment, practice, and learn the great American composers of this century'

...don't you mean last century?

Dear Mark: I apologize to anyone that mistook my postings as a 'glorified ego trip'....that was certainly not the direction that I was going. Those members of the group that have had contact with me in the past....and my postings for the record go back at least 3-4 years, can attest that I am not now, and have never been a 'boastful person', despite the way many may have have viewed this thread. It was Jive that cast the first stone, and I in no way meant any disrespect towards any member of this group. You would be surprised to learn of just how many truly great players read this group...and even more surprised to learn WHY they don't choose to respond or express their point of view. Years ago this was a great forum, I was there with BB Bean, Richard Bush, Miles Osland, Steve Carmichael, Morgan, and a host of other great cats that have all but vanished for similar reasons I'm sure. I don't have a problem with Jive, or anyone else for that matter, and my intital posting was a point of view that I had shared over the years with a number of cats that readily agreed.....Dizzy felt the same way that I do now 20 years ago, and it was a different scene all together back then. I firmly believe that where jazz is concerned...that we have moved backwards rather than forwards....it saddens me, as it should sadden us all. And to Glenn Wilson....I spoke with Richie tonight and read him your posting....your attempt at humor obviously missed it's mark....as I am sure that it will with Phil who I just forwarded your message to. I'm kind of curious to know who you have shared a bandstand with that could cut Phil, Diz, or any of the other cats that I have worked with and proudly call my friends. Again dear readers....no boasting there....but I don't know a single player around that would ever claim to be able to 'cut' them. I sincerely wish that this was the same forum that it was 3-4 years ago. It was a cool place back then, and the vibe was much more positive. The complete deja archive will be available soon....when it does become available I encourage anyone who is in the group now not only to research my postings....but go back and check out some of the other great cats that I mentioned and look upon their contributions as well. You'll then see what I am talking about....and realize hopefully exactly what's missing today.

Tiger Meazell Jazz Alto Saxophonist Boosey & Hawkes Artist/Clinician

'When in doubt...Chromatics!' - Phil Woods

damn, folks...

and, Ben, yup, I agree with your earlier post... last century!

later y'all

Oh, Brecker goes by the name Paul Lindemeyer. Really! Steve - also know as ....well ...nevermind

1 What is the 'point of view' that you are talking about? Your originating post was a little rambling, although you made some good points about mouthpieces being quite an individual thing, and it being important to listen to good musicians if you want to become one. If you think that music is dying then look beyond your own backyard.

2 If you don't like what people are posting, then post more yourself, or start another group. Personally I learn a lot from the group and have found many people to be friendly and generous with their help and time. Just a few are Tim Price with his suggestions for new artists to listen to, all the Steves with their great tips on instrument repair etc, Jive with his helpful advice to beginners, and so many others who are very helpful and generous with their time. Everybody helps everybody else on this group; big names and little alike.

3 I don't like this thing about namedropping and talk of people 'cutting each other on the bandstand'. In my mind that's nothing to do with making beautiful music. Some of my best musical experiences have been in very humble or unexpected contexts.

This whole thread is so depressing. Let's stop now, OK?

John C.